Who Owns Your Site - A Red Flag

[Chuck Roy]

A couple of weeks ago someone asked me how to transfer his domain registration to a less expensive registrar. His web hosting company charged him $35 per year and since the registration was going to expire in June, he wanted to transfer it now.

Well, I gave him the information about how to do it. End of conversation? Not quite. After I hung up the phone, I went to BetterWhoIs.com (http://betterwhois.com) and looked up his registration. I discovered that his web hosting company had set themselves up as the Registrant/Owner, Administrative Contact, Technical Contact, and Billing Contact for that domain. According to the registration database, he had no authority to make any changes to that domain record. I emailed him the updated info and he's still fighting with his hosting company about it.

The reason for relating this experience is to warn all webmasters and business owners that you need to always maintain control of your web site and domain name. Although most web hosting companies are honorable and have very good intentions for providing their customers the best service they can, situations change and you could end up being the loser.

One of our recent customers had a similar situation as the above, but their hosting company was bought by Earthlink. When the purchase occurred, all support and access to their web sites stopped without notice. Fortunately they were listed as the Owner for the domain and, since it was a small site and they had a backup of their pages, we were able to get their domain transferred and the web site back up quickly. However their situation could have been a total disaster.

The following are some steps you can take to ensure you can handle problems with your hosting company. I'm sure others will add to this list so continue reading all of the posts in this thread.

1) Be sure you are listed as the registrant/owner AND Administrative Contact for your domain. If you don't know how to do this, go to BetterWhoIs.com (http://betterwhois.com) and enter your domain name. The results should show you as the Registrant/Owner (first name on the list) and the Administrative Contact. Your web hosting company should be listed as the Technical Contact (unless you've arranged for someone else). The Billing Contact may vary depending on which registrar you use and your arrangements with your web hosting company.

2) Read AND UNDERSTAND all of your Web Hosting and Domain Registration Contracts in very fine detail. Just because we live on the Internet and things move much faster is no reason to ignore good business practices. If you don't understand something, get your hosting company to explain it in writing.

3) Maintain offsite backup copies of all your web site files. If you have a really big site, consider using one or more of the companies on the net that will store files for you. You may also consider using a DSL or other dedicated high-speed Internet connection to download the files and store them on CD (get a CDRW) or DVD (DVRW drives are now becoming available). Don't put all your faith in your host's backups. If they go under, you're the one who loses.

4) Always have an alternative way to get to the Internet. If your ISP is down, be sure you can still access your site, get your orders, etc. The free ISP services work well for this.

5) Consider purchasing your own SSL certificate for your web site. Prices are reasonable and you won't need to depend on your host company. If you do a lot of business consider what will happen if your web hosting company lets their certificate expire. How much business will you lose?

6) Establish a good relationship with your hosting company, preferably with one or two individuals. Exchange emails with them regularly. If you build up that relationship, you may hear about upcoming events that will affect you.

7) Check your host's web site periodically. They may have added new plans or other information without telling their existing customers.

Well, this has gotten too long. I'll let others add to this list. Just remember that your web business is REAL and it is YOUR BUSINESS - treat it as such.:)

[Jaiem]

That's unfortunately all too common a thing. It's a very cheesy way of a host to keep the clients sith them.

The domain name belongs to the customer.

[James]

Thanks for the advice Chuck,

We faced a domain dispute last year which had some real similarities to the story you related.

We luckily caught it in time, but it highlighted to us a whole new industry of fraud which we weren't aware of!

[yourdomainhost]

This may be slightly off-topic, but the single biggest problem we see is that domain registrants don't keep their administrative and billing contact e-mail addresses current and valid. So, they don't get their renewal notices, and they end up jumping through hoops whenever they want to modify their domain record. With OpenSRS registrations, if you lose your username and password, you'll need a working administrative contact e-mail address to retrieve it. I'm not sure what happens if you don't have either, but I bet it's a hassle.

So ... keep your registration record up-to-date, and update your contact records before you cancel your e-mail account.

James

[HyperHosting]

With OpenSRS registrations, if you lose your username and password, you'll need a working administrative contact e-mail address to retrieve it. I'm not sure what happens if you don't have either, but I bet it's a hassle.

It's actually not quite as bad as you may think. You need to send a faxed letter of authorization to change the email address to OpenSRS preferably on letterhead otherwise you need to provide identification that you are who you say you are.

So far only one customer had to go through this and it only took them a day or two to process it and to update their database.

Never the less your advice is excellent and why wait the extra day or two when you could have updated it yourself with the proper password.

[Chuck Roy]

One of our customers had a similar problem with Network Solutions. The customer is a statewide high school student association. When they registered their domain name, the Owner, Admin., and Billing contacts were listed in their President's name (a high school senior) and the Tech contact was their former hosting company.

When they decided to switch their hosting, their former host refused to assist in any fashion. Since the President had long since graduated, gone off to college, and no longer had his email account, we had to go the fax route.

I insisted that they make someone on their board as the Admin contact to eliminate that problem in the future. We also set us up as the Technical contact. If they decide to use another host, we will assist them in getting their registration transferred. We never can understand why some people are willing to burn bridges with former customers.

Additionally, as a result of this problem, we now periodically check every customer's whois record to be sure it conforms to our records. If not, we can contact the customer and get it resolved before a problem occurs.

Chuck Roy
Roy Services

[HostingNewbie]

Originally posted by Jaiem
That's unfortunately all too common a thing. It's a very cheesy way of a host to keep the clients sith them.

The domain name belongs to the customer.

I'm thinking of offerring free domain names to customers however, in such cases, I would like to register the domain as us being the owner. The client would get the benefit of the free domain name until he/she chooses to leave. Then, I intend to offer the domain name to them for sale for a small fee say $30.


If a new client came to me with a domain name, I would not ever, attempt to take ownership - merely request that it points to my DNS servers.

Is this an acceptable way to do business ?

[Jaiem]

So your including the use of the domain name when they sign up for your service?

IMO, as long as you fully disclose that the name belongs to you, you have control over the name and they can only obtain control by purchasing it from you, then it seems OK to me.

Not sure how many takers you'll get with such a deal however. It would be like owning a building that sits on leased land. The land owner can always tell you to get your building off his land!

[BarefootMamma]

This happened to my client! UGH! HE signed up for services with a host who offered free registration. NOt long after, I checked the WHOIS and saw the host listed at all of the contacts. He was angry. After speaking with the host, they said that they always do that for free registrations. THey hold on to the domain for 6 months to retain the customer. That's horrible practice, but we decided to put up with it. They never mentioned the 6 months, thign, by the way. It conveneiently showed up in the TOS as soon as the complaints started rolling in.

Now, the host has gone, well...let's just say it isn't very good. THey migrated their servers last week, and despite promise of less than 24 hours of down time, my clients site has been down for a week. The host is not answering their phone or e-mails...it's frustrating.

Now, my client wants to go to a new host, as do I...but it seems we're stuck for 3 more months with these idiots. There's got to be a way out of this...

[HostingNewbie]

Barefootmama, sorry to hear about your client having difficulties.

But I still remain convinced that my method is an acceptable way to do business. My plan was to retain ownership of the domain but offer it free of charge to my hosting clients for as long as they as customers (i'd like not to lose any if possible!)

If my client wants to leave then I will offer them the opportunity to purchase the domain for something like $20 (just a fee for time spent).

I will make it clear in the signup that customers do NOT own domain names obtained free from us.

I also intend to hand over the domain as quickly as possible as soon as I have received the fee.

At the moment I do not see what is wrong with this as a practice. At the end of the day I do not intend to stitch people up for 6 months or whatever. Its just a free offer to get people to become customers and stay customers. If someone had a problem with my service, I'd be the first to apologise and if they wouldn't stay, I'd hand over the domain (probably free at this stage).

But I do not want people coming along, taking a free domain and then leaving. Apart from a quality service, you still need some sort of incentive to keep people on board ?

[BarefootMamma]

See, I don't think its a big deal so long as the customer knows what's happening. My client showed me the copy of his registration, and he listed himself as the admin, and myself for technical contact. He also printed everything he could find about the terms of service on the account...no where did it mention the 6 month thing.

The one thing he did NOT print, though, was a page that did have the 6-month thing buried in all the text.

They were not at all upfront with us about it, and that's what's aggrivating. They said that the registration was free. There was no other stipulation.

I think that if you say something like, "Use of the domain is included in the hosting fees. If at such time you wish to trnasfer your domain to another host, we will charge a $20 service fee." That's pretty clear, and I would understand that completely.

Frankly, I know of some people that wouldn't mind that because they don't want personal info listed in the WHOIS database...and I understand that.

I think what you're planning is fine, so long as you make it very clear...I'm upset that they told him his domain would be free, then they said that wasn't all exactly true.

The host did tell me that they require the 6 months so people don't just get a free domain and take off. We were willing to stay. The price was decent and we had a nice plan, and good speed...up until a week ago.

Right now, though, I can't afford to stay with this host. My pay depends on my client getting jobs...and he doesn't get jobs without the site working. The site got him a great jpb opening for a famous band...and the attention of some high profile agents. It doesn't look good to have this buzz going on and a site that sucks because the e-mail and database don't work.

[wowewo]

I read in a past reply "The domain name belongs to the customer." This is not true. The domain name belongs to whom ever registered it. In the past I have runs sales where I give away free web addresses to customers that wish to sign up. Well since one month of hosting is far less than any registrar I've seen for a year, people were signing up then transfering their domain name.

SOmeone said "What a cheezy tactic by web hosting companies to keep customers." I say what a cheezy tactic by cheap customers to screw hosting companies.

I changed my policy for those sales. I now hold ownership of the domain names for one year and if they customer wants to switch hosting companies they have to pay a transfer fee equal to the cost of current registration. I think that is fair.

[HyperHosting]

wowewo, just so you know this thread was a bit old when you replied to it. It's still a valid topic though so I don't think any of the moderators will mind.

I agree that it's a bad tactic by the customer to register for the free domain name and then cancel right away only to keep the domain name. As long as you make it clear to the customer that the domain must be hosted with you for X months before it becomes theirs I think it's fine. They just have to know the terms and conditions on the offer before signing up.

There are always a few bad customers who spoil it for the rest. It's similar to a big problem I had to deal with when we used Commission Junction (http://www.cj.com). Customers would order using their own referral code, which didn't bother me that much, but many would then do a charge back months after they ordered. Since CJ.com only gave me 15 days (I believe) their commission has already been approved and then months later I get the charge back. So they get their commission plus a domain and there wasn't much I could do about it.

The point being is you have to be very careful with special offers to new customers.

[wowewo]

I just joined so I figured I could fire up some old topics which interested me. Like you said it's old but still valid. This is an ongoing problem and will continue to be a problem.