Please Read Everyone

[baku]

Several "Host Directory" or "Host Review" sites have come online publishing lists of "Top 10 Hosts" or "Top 25 Hosts" or "Best Low-Cost Hosts." Most Host Directory sites have little interest in providing real assistance to hosting customers, and every interest in getting more advertising dollars from the web hosting services that support them -- note how many of their advertisers are "recommended." Ignore all their ratings -- they're useless, and have nothing to do with the real-life experiences of webmasters. On many of these sites, hosts pay for their high ratings. We have been hosted with three "Top 25" companies and have not been impressed, to say the least! CI Host was rated in the top five on many of these sites until their total melt-down -- our one month with CI Host was nothing short of disastrous, and we were certainly not the only ones to have this type of experience. They have an "Unsatisfactory" rating with the BBB, and we believe it was our August '98 complaint that first brought CI Host to the attention of the BBB of Fort Worth, Texas. You can read about their December, 1999 "glitch" as reported on SlashDot (it's a big page and takes a bit of time to load). The story was also picked up by MSNBC and PC Week. In addition to stories about the melt-down, MSNBC had posted the article "CIHost exposes credit card numbers" (now gone). There are a lot of unhappy former CI Host customers out there, and many of them have banded together to petition for class action status in a lawsuit against CI Host.

Don't put any trust in Host Directories with "voting" options: ballots can be stuffed. Some sites try to get around this by requiring that you currently have a website hosted by the company you vote on. Of course, if you were unhappy with a host you've probably left it by the time you find one of these voting options. Don't believe lists of "reviews" either. Many of these sites simply filter out negative reviews, especially of companies that buy advertising from them. Review sites are also very easy to "spam" with positive reviews. As a participant pointed out on one of the forums we monitor, he found one host with a half-dozen good reviews at one Host Directory site, all posted by "different" people with, surprise!, the same e-mail address, which just happened to be the address of the owner of that hosting company. It's all too easy to get a dozen hotmail/yahoo/whatever free e-mail accounts for the purpose of spamming these sites with favorable reviews. Note whether or not these sites accept advertising, who their advertisers are, and who's getting good reviews. Any company still accepting advertising from CI Host should be viewed with great scepticism. You can also ignore the Web Host Guild, which is little more than an organization of major hosting companies interested in self-promotion, and whose "Charter Members" include three hosts we've been unhappy with.


HostGlobal is well aware of the problems CommuniTech is causing for its customers, according to a now-disappeared post by the owner on one of the forums we monitor. Yet, they list CommuniTech, one of their "sponsors," as a "featured host," instead of listing them under their "Consumer Alert" section. Money speaks louder than the truth in this business.

There are some reports that HostSearch filters negative reviews and does not post all of them. They accept advertising from CI Host, as well as CommuniTech.

HostCrawler is another directory site to avoid. If you do a whois on hostcrawler.com, you'll see that the website is hosted by PowerSurge, which just happens to be highly rated on every one of their rating pages. Hmmm, why do you suppose that is? At the time of this writing, the only other hosts they recommend are all hosts people have had major problems with, including CI Host.

HostIndex.com recommends several hosts people have reported serious problems with, including CI Host, Interland, and CommuniTech.

4WebHosting.com lists TrueHosting as a "Great" host!!

Compare TopHosts.com's list of recommended hosts to our list of hosts about which people frequently post complaints, and with the hosts on Rob Silvera's Web Hosts That Suck page. 'Nuf said.

ISPcheck, ditto. They also publish Web Hosting Magazine, which recently gave an award to CI Host. As we said, just ignore these rating/review services.

The Ultimate Web Host List (purchased by CNET) appears to have been removed from c|net's website. We think this may be due to all the heat c|net took from angry webmasters for their years of recommending CI Host (and hosts like Tri Star Web and Virtualis / Virtualisys), after CI Host's total melt-down in December of 1999. We're leaving this warning up in case the Ultimate Web Host List surfaces elsewhere, either under its former name or under a new name. Their ratings were not based on the real-world experiences of webmasters, and their positive review sent us to the worst host we've ever had. Jonathan Caputo, the (former?) owner and founder of The Ultimate Web Host List and the only one responsible for choosing which hosts were "recommended," e-mailed us after reading this page to say in part, "I read your article and was upset that a few of the hosting companies you read favorable reviews on our site did not work out as you had hoped." We replied with a 1600-word e-mail describing our unpleasant experiences with two of the hosts he recommends, and included quotes from e-mail we'd received from three former customers of one of their most highly-rated hosts, demonstrating a clear and unmistakable pattern of customer abuse and outright dishonesty. We suggested they re-examine both their rating policy and that particular hosting service. The reply we received above the quote of our e-mail, in toto: "Not sure what to make of your below response, but again better luck next time selecting a hosting provider! Sorry we couldnt be of more help to you." Note that he is also the founder of the totally useless Web Host Guild. If you see Jonathan Caputo's name connected with any Host Directory website, exercise extreme caution! Shame on c|net for ever allowing those recommendations to be posted on their website without adequate oversight or fact-checking!

[Jaiem]

Ratings are easily fixed.

NTL, you can use them as a guide but you still have to do your homework.

[GregS]

Hi,

I own a hosting company (just coming clean here so no one thinks i'm pretending to be a client), and I think you hit the nail right on the head.......I would like to add one more note:


Many of the host search and directory sites are actually owned and run by hosting companies.....that way they can recommend and feature themselves for no fees at all.


I hope everyone takes your well written post seriously, and use the search tools on the sites instead of going with the "recommended" or "featured" host......as it is a big scam like you say.


CIHost puts more money into advertising than all the rest, and they also have the most complaints by far.

[Jaiem]

Whether it be web hosting, car buying, college selection or employment everyone is looking for a objective yard stick to make a very subjective decision.

In some ways it's also an easy out. A person just goes with the #1 choice figuring they know more tyan you.

No matter what it is do your home work!

[Synergy]

Actually CIHOST is pretty good right now! I have a couple of friends using them and no complaints for a couple of months. The phone calls were picked up. I guess they have learned their lesson.

[James]

I have to come to our industry's defence here. You can never win this argument. Any hosting directory that gives awards will always be subject to a lot of sceptism.

If we give an award to an existing advertiser no matter how good they are, we are accused of favouritism. If we give an award to a company that isn't an advertiser, and they subsequently become one, then we are accused of giving them an incentive to advertise.

Its a catch 22 situation. I think with quality directories which has been around for a long time, if their reviews didn't hold some water people would stop using them as a hosting resource.

I'm not actively involved in the awards process at Web Host Directory, but I do have involvement in the advertising side of the business. I can tell you that the large proportion of our award winners have never been advertisers.

As far as CI Host is concerned, I've made my views know on their business operations on numerous posts on this forum and many others. How does that old adage go "leopards and spots.........

[akashik]

How does that old adage go "leopards and spots.........

Umm, leopards have spots cause they're dirty kitties and need to be thrown in the dishwasher?

sorry.. I've been up way too long. :sleep:

A lot of directories are just crap. I even thought of making one myself once as it seems like a great way to sit back and wait for the checks to roll in. Having said that, there's very little chance I'd be posting away here having my name associated with webhostdir if I though James and the gang weren't actually interested in making the hosting world a better place. Sure they make a few bucks out of this place (maybe more than a few), but I'm yet to really notice any bias here.

Greg Moore

[Phoenix]

Originally posted by akashik
A lot of directories are just crap. I even thought of making one myself once as it seems like a great way to sit back and wait for the checks to roll in. Having said that, there's very little chance I'd be posting away here having my name associated with webhostdir if I though James and the gang weren't actually interested in making the hosting world a better place. Sure they make a few bucks out of this place (maybe more than a few), but I'm yet to really notice any bias here.

I agree with you on that, akashik. I did some research into web hosting directories a while back, and they seem to exist for one reason-making money from advertising. Nothing wrong with that, but what value do they provide for their advertisers other than meaningless awards handed out to their best customers? Which incents them to keep advertising and maybe give them even more dinero to improve their rankings.

James and Tommy strike me as people who are interested in more than just running webhostdir as a cash cow, but also in giving back to the industry that provides them with revenue. Helping web hosts improve their own industry benefits their business, but it benefits the hosts more.

[yourdomainhost]

Originally posted by spoon_man
Moderator's Comments: No Spam!!

I can delete your spams all day long. Enjoy yourself!

I'm sure we all appreciate that you're killing the spam posts. However, I just went through about 6 scrolls to discover that there was really nothing of interest to read on this post that was showing as containing something new.

Can't you just delete the spam messages without commenting? Or would it still show as containing new info?

Just an idea.

James

[James]

I know what you mean it gets pretty annoying when an idiot like spoonman posts 25 times in various forums. Unfortunately even when we delete his spam without commenting it still shows up as a new post! He even appears in the last post column when he no longer exsists as a member.

All we can do it hit these idiots quickly. The mods got to him very quickly, but he had just copied and pasted 25 times!

[darcast]

AMEN !

[akashik]

The comments (if we make any at all) are usually directly to the spam clown, as notice that we're onto them. It's annoying for everyone, I know, especially those of us that have to clean up after these deficients. The posts and/or threads usually stay for a while, then get flushed out and deleted so we don't have threads starting with 'Turns $6 in millions' etc on them.

I get the feeling this is just one guy (or a small few) that is doing this. As a spammer he's going to lack a lot by default (consideration, intelligence, tact, manners) as it's genetically bred into the species. If he did have many of the above qualities he'd have a real job and wouldn't have to resort to trying to take the hard earnt money from others at their expense.

So on his behalf, as he doesn't have the faculty to understand the consequences of acting the clown, I apologise for the 'new post' alerts when all that's happening is we're cleaning the trash out.

Greg Moore

[Jaiem]

Greg,

You gotta admit that guy had determination! He was posting every 2 minutes for almost an hour!! I was able to get them as he posted but still, he must have had nothing better to do that day. :)

[akashik]

yes he was a plucky little soldier in the great spam war, that's for sure :D One of the more annoying ones to date. (I don't think I can bring myself to consider it determined)

I usually liken it to junkies. If they could only generate as much passion and 'need to suceed' in getting real honest work done instead of trying so hard to get the easy life and a quick score then they'd be millionaires, instead of trying to convince everyone they are...

Greg Moore

[Phoenix]

If they could only generate as much passion and 'need to suceed' in getting real honest work done instead of trying so hard to get the easy life and a quick score then they'd be millionaires, instead of trying to convince everyone they are...

I used to have a roommate who believed every get-rich-quick scheme there is. Nice guy, great friend, always bought the round when it was his turn, but not the sharpest tool in the shed.

Get rich quick schemes usually cost money. He'd buy the books and the videos and never realized that the only person who gets rich off one of these schemes is the person selling the books and videos, not the 'ones born every minute' who buy the stuff.

His belief in the possiblity of a miraculous move to Easy Street, made him a perfect mark for these con artists.

[Frosty]

Phoenix,

You mean your room-mate bought stuff like the "Carlton Sheets" (buying real-estate with no money down) and "30 days to financial freedom"?

ha ha..... i bought that stupid buying real-estate with no money down books cause i was curious about it. Of course my mom told me over and over again that there is no such thing as buying houses with NO money down. (She buys foreclosures all the time so she knows). And she was right, i should`ve listened. By the way does anyone here know who i`m talking about...that a**hole Carlton Sheets?

My mom`s best friend dated a man who owns a freakin chain of "walmart" stores who lives right next to that Carlton Sheets real estate man. That jerk Carlton Sheets doesn`t make his money from real-estate. He gets it from selling them crappy books. And i was told that Carlton is a drunk and his 20 year old girl friend he had around his arm looked like a whore. Both Carlton sheets and that walmart man were constantly drunk. And they are both pigs. I was told some really interesting stuff about that real-estate and that walmart dude.

whoops, i just babbled screwed up paragraph. i sit too much all by myself in front of my computer.

:eek: :eek:

[ny777]

CI Host is the WORST webhost ever.

They are also the most UNETHICAL people you could ever meet.

Be WARNED and do beware!! It'll cost you!!

:o :mad: :cry: :mad:

[Eladesor]

but I'm yet to really notice any bias here.

And it doesn't just apply to the advertising either, the fact that 99.9% of members of this forum are also un-biased and 'realistic' in there views and opinions is the only reason I visit.

Apart from the comments previously made, I have also noticed a disturbing trend on some forums (not his one) where someone raises the question "what do the you think about.........host", (who just happens to be one of the sites sponsors!).
As if by magic! a glowing report is given in response - the odd thing is that:
The person asking the question signed up - that day (post No.1) and guess what? the reply also comes from someone who just happened to sign up that same day (Also post No.1)
Even more amazing - both posters are never heard of again!
Smacks of rigging to me :mad: which only results in one thing - conned, disappointed- mislead customers!

Regards

[James]

We appreciate the feedback, its good to know that the forum is providing a valuable function. We've worked hard on keeping things as neutral as possible.

[Jaiem]

Eladesor,

That's not new. In many forums (not just about hosting) it's very common for the site owner or friends or associates of the owner to post "What do you think of...?" or "Where can I find....?" messages then reply to them recommending the owner's site.

Very cheesey but also very hard to detect.

[HostingCatalog]

In defense of hosting directories:

I operate a hosting directory and I know several other hosting directory owners, not everyone one of these sites is 100% sold out.

Sure, we sell ads and premium listings in our directory. These ads and listings are clearly marked for the viewer to read. We do not offer a rating system, but we do offer a review forum where members can review their hosts, and we don't require them to currently hold an account with that host.

I am sure I peek for the owners of many directories when I say that not all of us are dishonest.

Unfortunately, I have noticed that the larger a directory gets, the more sold out it gets. I hope this is not going to be the case with my company, and the others I have visited.

[James]

I would have thought selling out (your ad space) is your primary purpose as an owner of a directory. I don't think people should be penalised for succeeding in their chosen industry.

At the end of the day people come to directories to find a host, if they are directed towards hosts that actually willing to pay to gain their business is that a bad thing?

[HostingCatalog]

Selling out ad space...yes.

Selling out false reviews, or rating bad hosts good because they pay...no.

[James]

Yes I agree reviews and awards shouldn't be compromised, but directories get criticised for other failings as well.